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is this DMA idea achievable if done correctly?

Discussion on is this DMA idea achievable if done correctly? within the Technical Support forum part of the Off-Topics category.

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Old   #1
 
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Thumbs up is this DMA idea achievable if done correctly?

Concept for a New Version of DMA Using a Modified SSD

I have an interesting idea for a new version of DMA that leverages how SSDs already function. Most SSDs behave like a kind of DMA (Direct Memory Access) device as they read and write data while operating on your PC. My idea is to use a modified SSD (likely a custom-made one) that acts not only as a storage device (holding files, such as game files) but also as a DMA-enabled device.

When files are stored on this device, the SSD—acting as both an SSD and a DMA card—would be able to read data (e.g., game files) and send the required data to a second PC. The host PC would not flag the device because the SSD already behaves like a typical DMA device while functioning as storage.

Although this is still a concept in its early stages, I believe it could work with the right prebuilt firmware to ensure the SSD functions as a standard storage device. Additionally, with some knowledge and careful design, the limitations of which files might get flagged once read can be figured out.

I am not an expert in PCs, so this is just an idea to make DMA access easier, bypassing the need for third-party DMA firmware providers and avoiding the ban waves that have been affecting DMA users. Yes, I know that with the right firmware, one doesn’t have to worry about detection, but I think this device could perform exceptionally well because the game files would actually be stored on the DMA device itself, making it harder to detect or block.

Of course, there are some obvious challenges and concerns I haven’t fully addressed, and I’m sure people will point out weaknesses or flaws in the idea. But, given that the storage location of the game files is on the same device, it could offer a significant advantage in accessing information. As for the physical design of such a device, I’m not sure exactly what it would look like, but I do feel it could perform very well.

Add-On: Physical Design and Improved Hiding Method

Additionally, this device could provide an even better hiding method physically. Since it can connect via SATA ports (standard for SSDs), it could be concealed inside the computer case without raising suspicion. Most users wouldn’t be likely to notice, and the fact that it's hidden behind the case makes it harder for others to detect or tamper with.

This approach could also eliminate the need for custom firmware. Because the DMA functionality is already built into the device and the SSD itself behaves like a standard storage device, the firmware would essentially be pre-built into the component. This means that there would be no need for additional custom firmware to mask the DMA behavior. The device would inherently work as an SSD while enabling DMA operations in the background.

By masking its DMA capabilities and presenting itself as a regular SSD to the host, it could offer a stealthier and more efficient method for data manipulation between two systems. Of course, this would still require robust firmware, good design, and thorough testing to ensure the device performs reliably and is secure. But overall, the ability to have built-in stealth without relying on extra firmware could significantly streamline the process and reduce the risk of detection.

Add-On: The Bridge Concept – SSD-DMA-Device-Host PC Setup


Another potential variation of this DMA concept could involve an add-on device that acts as a bridge between the SSD and the host PC, making the integration even simpler and more flexible. Instead of modifying the SSD itself or building a custom DMA-capable SSD from scratch, this add-on device would sit between the SSD and the host PC, effectively acting as an intermediary between the two. Either of the two ideas would perform similarly, though this add-on approach does seem simpler overall, as it allows you to turn your existing SSD into a bridge for the DMA to act upon without the need to replace or modify the storage device itself.

This setup would make it even easier to integrate the DMA functionality with the existing system, eliminating the need to directly alter the SSD or tamper with its firmware. The add-on device would provide the same benefits as modifying the SSD directly, but with an added layer of modularity and flexibility.

This approach provides a modular solution, allowing easy integration with any SSD, without requiring significant changes to the system. The add-on device acts as a stealthy, efficient bridge, enabling complex data operations without compromising security or performance. If properly designed, this could be a more flexible and stealthier alternative to traditional DMA setups, while providing a much-needed flexible solution for data manipulation in a variety of use cases.



from yours truly , loopy

dont flame me if this is a shit idea i just wanted to know if my idea was an actual feasible one....
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Old 01/25/2025, 17:11   #2
 
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Unfeasible, my friend. You won’t be able to reverse-engineer the SSD PCB. You can’t make a custom PCB or anything similar to mitigate that delay because any customized hardware will be detected through packet analysis and inspection. For example, you can’t use an Arduino as a mouse anymore because most advanced anti-cheats analyze HID devices and inspect the packets being sent to the operating system. They’ll recognize its descriptors.

I assume we’re talking about advanced anti-cheats here, especially because of DMA. These anti-cheats will catch it fairly quickly, and even the methods that survive might get detected within three months or so since it's a common bypass. If you get what I mean, it’s definitely a cool idea, and almost anything is possible, but this is extremely advanced.

Not trying to discredit you! 90% chance wouldn't work out. Why would a SSD card be reading memory.

here is an example:

Quote:
Parameter
Value

Hardware ID
USB\VID_0781&PID_55BB&REV_6004

Setup Class
SCSIAdapter

Class GUID
{4d36e97b-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}

PDO Name
\Device\USBPDO-3

Service Name
UASPStor





Parameter
Value

Connection Information

ConnectionIndex
0x1

CurrentConfigurationValue
0x1

Speed
0x2 (UsbHighSpeed)

DeviceIsHub
FALSE

DeviceAddress
0x8

NumberOfOpenPipes
0x4

ConnectionStatus
DeviceConnected

Pipe #0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x81 [IN]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

Pipe #1

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x2 [OUT]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

Pipe #2

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x83 [IN]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

Pipe #3

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x4 [OUT]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

Device Descriptor

bLength
0x12

bcdUSB
0x320

bDeviceClass
0x0

bDeviceSubClass
0x0

bDeviceProtocol
0x0

bMaxPacketSize0
0x9

idVendor
0x781 (SanDisk Corp. )

idProduct
0x55BB

bcdDevice
0x6004

iManufacturer
0x2 (0x409: SanDisk)

iProduct
0x3 (0x409: Portable SSD)

iSerialNumber
0x1 (0x409: 323332344155343034393837)

bNumConfigurations
0x1





Parameter
Value

Configuration Descriptor

bLength
0x9

bDescriptorType
USB_CONFIGURATION_DESCRIPTOR_TYPE

wTotalLength
0x79

bNumInterfaces
0x1

bConfigurationValue
0x1

iConfiguration
0x0

bmAttributes
0x80 ( Bus_Powered )

MaxPower
0x70

Interface Descriptor

bLength
0x9

bInterfaceNumber
0x0

bAlternateSetting
0x0

bNumEndpoints
0x2

bInterfaceClass
0x8 (Mass Storage)

bInterfaceSubClass
0x6 (SCSI Transparent Command Set)

bInterfaceProtocol
0x50 (Bulk-Only Transport)

iInterface
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x81 [IN]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0xF

bmAttributes
0x0 (MaxStreams : 0)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x2 [OUT]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0xF

bmAttributes
0x0 (MaxStreams : 0)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

Interface Descriptor

bLength
0x9

bInterfaceNumber
0x0

bAlternateSetting
0x1

bNumEndpoints
0x4

bInterfaceClass
0x8 (Mass Storage)

bInterfaceSubClass
0x6 (SCSI Transparent Command Set)

bInterfaceProtocol
0x62

iInterface
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x81 [IN]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0xF

bmAttributes
0x5 (MaxStreams : 5)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x2 [OUT]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0xF

bmAttributes
0x5 (MaxStreams : 5)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x83 [IN]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0xF

bmAttributes
0x5 (MaxStreams : 5)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

Endpoint Descriptor

bLength
0x7

bEndpointAddress
0x4 [OUT]

bmAttributes
0x2 (USB_ENDPOINT_TYPE_BULK)

wMaxPacketSize
0x400

bInterval
0x0

SuperSpeed Endpoint Companion Descriptor

bLength
0x6

bMaxBurst
0x0

bmAttributes
0x0 (MaxStreams : 0)

wBytesPerInterval
0x0

CipherCircuit is offline  
Old 01/31/2025, 04:55   #3
 
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so I saw that maybe that helps you
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