This is why the server concepts suck.

[lucienne]

To be honest, when this thread was started, I knew that the majority will fail to understand many important points. But the reality appeared to be much worse.


This is unbelievable that most who posted here failed to understand that "reward for kill" (at CTF, and it's often seen in other events) is just wrong.
Stuff like "different builds have different chance in getting kills" should never be mentioned. This is really stupid. Rewards only for kill, in a TEAM based game, brings the whole play(teamwork) down to a primitive, lowest level, lowest quality of play. Such events, where only kill is rewarded, are just trash. It's only fun for those who know nothing about the game, and the only thing they can do is blunt damage rush.

You want **** to be fair and let people with support classes go DD?

What I'm going to write should not be written because it's obvious. I have no idea how it's even possible not to understand this.
People should be able to play ANY role and still get rewards. In TEAM activities, starting from about medium quality of team work, impact of different roles is the same in the end. The only thing what competent players care about is if their team wins or not. No one counts personal kills nor personal performance.

[​Exo]

^Not every build should be eligible to own every part of the gameplay. That's not how games work. A build has advantages and disadvantages. Not saying I agree with akasch but just what you're saying doesn't make much sense to me. You are not supposed to make it fair for every single build.

[BordoMavi*]

Originally Posted by lucienne

To be honest, when this thread was started, I knew that the majority will fail to understand many important points. But the reality appeared to be much worse.


This is unbelievable that most who posted here failed to understand that "reward for kill" (at CTF, and it's often seen in other events) is just wrong.
Stuff like "different builds have different chance in getting kills" should never be mentioned. This is really stupid. Rewards only for kill, in a TEAM based game, brings the whole play(teamwork) down to a primitive, lowest level, lowest quality of play. Such events, where only kill is rewarded, are just trash. It's only fun for those who know nothing about the game, and the only thing they can do is blunt damage rush.


What I'm going to write should not be written because it's obvious. I have no idea how it's even possible not to understand this.
People should be able to play ANY role and still get rewards. In TEAM activities, starting from about medium quality of team work, impact of different roles is the same in the end. The only thing what competent players care about is if their team wins or not. No one counts personal kills nor personal performance.

words can't describe my feelings right now but THANK YOU

[rares495]

Originally Posted by ​Exo

^Not every build should be eligible to own every part of the gameplay. That's not how games work. A build has advantages and disadvantages. Not saying I agree with akasch but just what you're saying doesn't make much sense to me. You are not supposed to make it fair for every single build.

Point is people should enjoy playing every build without constantly worrying about damage or kills or stuff like that. Especially in the euro camp where there are so many support builds. As was stated before, in a party fight every player has a role and what matters is the team's overall performance. And that's great! It encourages teamwork which is important in this game after all. But not important as it should be. Which means there's some work that needs to be done.

Obviously there are some builds better suited for certain activities than others, but that doesn't mean we should create equal chances for everyone at those activities. No sir, you've chosen a certain build, you accept the drawbacks that come with it. That's how the game works. Instead of messing up current events which are mostly dominated by high damage builds, what should be done is creating new events targeting either team play(to include support builds alongside damage builds), creating new events just for support players(this one requires a lot of thought) OR disabling activities that don't involve teamwork(CTF, 1v1 PVP, etc). And no, 8 turks in a party gangbanging you at dw south or camping at your flag post in CTF isn't teamwork.

I'm all for default, stock, original silkroad. I don't really like it when people try to "balance" what already is a -somewhat- balanced game. Well, i'm not saying i completely disregard the idea of playing a modified version of silkroad but so far nobody has been able to come up with a real solution to the "problem". What has been done is either increased damage/passives for chinese characters or limited european characters. IMO that's not the way to do it. I feel like even the slightest modification of builds already causes a lot more problems than it solves.

Instead of changing builds, i would look in a different direction. Certainly the game has bigger issues. In my eyes, the biggest problem of all is botting. An action which has become embedded in players' DNA due to isro and which causes players to lose sight of what's actually important. Instead of just going with the flow of the game, people are rushing, getting last gear so quickly instead of relaxing and enjoying the game with their friends.

They fail to experience the most important part of silkroad and as a result they become mean, greedy and end up ruining the experience for others. Then they get bored, leave and start all over again on a different server. Achieving everything there is to achieve in a game in less than 6-12 months simply isn't right. You can clearly see how that's retarded. You just have to look at some of the major games out there like counter-strike or dota.

It's not only the server owners' fault either. It's a mentality issue as well. People are lazy and are making excuses to use bots like "i have a life", "i go to work" etc. but in reality they're just afraid. They're afraid of being surpassed, like being in the top is so important when it clearly isn't. People still think that this game is a competition.

I think that's because the servers are filled with newbies pretending to have been here from the start when they've actually started playing after 2011. They don't even know the basics of the game yet they act like they're so pro with their external help lol. They don't know the struggle of isro, the need to use autologin, the joy when seeing a rare item on the ground, etc. Basically they don't know what silkroad is. To them botting = playing.

So, IMO, you either figure out a way to address these issues properly or you stick to the original game with few cosmetic or gameplay-enhancing modifications. There's no in-between. If you want your server to survive, that is. And even then, there's no guarantee that it will, but that's a different story.

Holy mother of text. Sorry about that I kinda turned it into a rant about botting instead of writing what i should have. Sorry about that too To be continued...

[Finsterlord]

Originally Posted by BordoMavi*

Imagine that you could register for BA whenever you want, as soon as a matching enemy team is found you get a message and can teleport to the arena. Total number of entries per day: 5 or something like that.

First of all, thanks, you understood my points. I also thought about this idea. It would be great but not sure if it's easy to implement - probably not.

Well, if I could decide about a server I would offer both PTBA and random BA in change every hour. The other types of BA only would occur once or twice a day (job, guild etc.). As far as I know you need at least 5 players in a PT to register for PTBA. I don't know if that limit can be changed. Therefore having SA (Survival Arena) would be nice as it is possible to be played by smaller teams too (4vs4).


About that "making builds fair"-discussion: I'm not intending to make every build have the same chances. Instead it is more like every build at least HAS a chance to participate in (team) activities playing it's supposed role and get rewarded. I think the previous posts described it already better than I could do right now.

[Royalblade*]

Originally Posted by BordoMavi*

I don't think shit through? You're just thinking too superficial.
What you think is:

1) Unequal gear, newbies are in a big disadvantage, can't farm their coins to get better gear (ok, makes sense)

2) Solution: Let's give them all the same gear
(ok, makes sense as well, but this alone is not enough to make things fair since everything that matters is KILLING (keyword bladers etc.))

3) Second Solution: Since some builds deal low damage and tend to be ksed very often let's give them the chance to change their builds as well
=> ok now things get interesting..

1st scenario (only chin server): a server which already had around 50% spear nukers is going to have 99% spear nukers at CTF.. why would somebody choose to play a blader for ctf, right!?

2nd scenario (eu/ch server): a server which already had around 50% wizards is going to have 90% wizards at CTF

If i wanted to play a spear nuker or wizard i would have created one.
If i create a blader i want to play a fucking blader, and not change my build for a specific event in order to get my coins. This is just retarded.
You are trying to make things fair?
Akasch: No sorry, YOU are retarded. How is this even an excuse. If you want to stay blader. Go ahead do it. Nobody is stopping you there. Bladers work just fine against spearnukers. All that THIS creates is a VALID mechanism for CTF to work. Else is useless AF and unfair AF. Use that brain of yours to think properly.


^There is your answer.
If you have the possibility to let the people farm their coins with the build they choose to play, why the hell would you force them to play a different build for 20minutes of ctf? (i'm not speaking of the set switch thing)

Btw, i guess you didn't get what i was trying to say by mentioning the FW and uniques thing..
If CTF is unfair for newbies, then FW and uniques are unfair as well, why don't you implement the same shit there as well? Simply because it's retarded af

Too superficial. Indeed!

You want new players to get a chance at CTF and its' respective rewards?

Did you read this? That's a lot more important than your class distribution.

Also I've never really had an issue with class distribution in the first place. It seems to be working out on my servers.


Now let me try to visualize this for you in a better way.

Feature: Capture the Flag
Aim: Let players compete in order to receive certain rewards.
Problem: Unfair due to equipment & class.
Solution: Equalized equipment

Now this makes CTF a VALID event. Elsewise, it's too unfair.
Your problem is invalid due to it being a very personalized opinion type of answer. That's not how it will work when players actually see that feature.

PS: It'll be in Elamidas 2. You'll see how everyone loves it.
PSS: Don't use the excuse "thats not how sro players think". Don't dare using that stupid loser excuse. You'll be falling a few levels further.

-------
Next topic:

Why is it that you guys use your own OPINION to judge a feature and you don't even use FACTS. You use fucking OPINIONS and "I WANT", "I LIKE", "WHY WOULD I". You guys think way too much in a wrong sense.

Vision. You don't have that.

This is one of the reasons why there is no innovation, why there is nothing new.

[BordoMavi*]

Originally Posted by Royalblade*

Bladers work just fine against spearnukers.

As lucienne said, shit is even worse than i thought. When was the last time you actually PLAYED sro?
Nvm, i'm not even going to comment the rest.

The last thing i want to say about this topic is:
YES, of course wicked's idea is better than the default CTF. BUT it's still not optimal. It solves 1 huge problem but causes another one. People WILL change their disadvantaged builds in order to farm their coins more efficiently. And YES they are more or less "forced" to do so. This is not an opinion, this is a FACT.

Originally Posted by Royalblade*

You want new players to get a chance at CTF and its' respective rewards?

Battle Arena gives them the chance to obtain these rewards without having to implement anything and without "forcing" them to change their build or at least leaving them in a disadvantage in case they choose to keep their build.

PS: We have never been talking about your "only chinese" servers in particular where 98% of the server consists of 3 builds (force glaiver/bower, spear nuker). Things are completely different and way easier when you disable the european race, which is the reason why u did so.
PPS: Start growing up, i assume you are going to hit 24 this year. I've never called YOU a retard or made fun of your origin. Stop acting like the godfather of the psro scene. You might be good in what you're doing but you clearly lack some game sense. We're just trying to have a nice discussion.
You want innovation? We are trying to contribute something but not for people with such a disrespectful attitude.

 Spoiler

Originally Posted by Royalblade*

You just dropped back to random arab level.
No sorry, YOU are retarded.

[​Exo]

Wicked's idea :c feelsbadman.jpeg
*cough* Had that implemented like a year ago haha. For some reason I also made it possible to change your build during ctf xd -not sure why tho-

Probably cuz some ppl like to switch builds and this would be a good opportunity? Idk it seemed like a cool thing to have.

[sinxtra]

The idea of having everyone with stock gear or different builds during CTF destroys the point of this topic.

[​Exo]

Originally Posted by sinxtra

The idea of having everyone with stock gear or different builds during CTF destroys the point of this topic.

Well, for CH only servers you could easily change CTF rewards to team. However, for EU/CH this would be the most unstable thing ever as you can't choose how the teams are distributed.

[sinxtra]

Originally Posted by ​Exo

Well, for CH only servers you could easily change CTF rewards to team. However, for EU/CH this would be the most unstable thing ever as you can't choose how the teams are distributed.

True but the real challenge here is to do it on EU/CH servers, to finally bring make them work together.
Limits aside you could divide 4CH and 4EU into each party, then again EU will always be more powerfull but you could change the CTF system to have more keys and a certain requirement to have atleast 6/8 members around the flag to capture it.

[​Exo]

Originally Posted by sinxtra

True but the real challenge here is to do it on EU/CH servers, to finally bring make them work together.

Limits aside you could divide 4CH and 4EU into each party, then again EU will always be more powerfull but you could change the CTF system to have more keys and a certain requirement to have atleast 6/8 members around the flag to capture it.

The real challenge is having src then* because once you have src it's not a challenge @*

[WickedNite.]

Originally Posted by sinxtra

True but the real challenge here is to do it on EU/CH servers, to finally bring make them work together.
Limits aside you could divide 4CH and 4EU into each party, then again EU will always be more powerfull but you could change the CTF system to have more keys and a certain requirement to have atleast 6/8 members around the flag to capture it.

You can't change the current distribution algorithm/system without SRC, not that we currently know of at least.

To all the haters that keep hatin on the equalized gear idea: If you can't do it, then it's normal to hate.

[JustNrik]

Your list lacks of things, these 4 things are just the top of the iceberg, there are so many reasons why so many server sucks nowdays, but you are right with everything you said.

Something I notice is that pServer are not using quest for anything, and when they do, it's just to bot 24/7 in job cave. They don't have originality to make a Quest-based system (Like most of MMORPGs actually are) that involves things like instance dungeons (like Holy Water Temple), Delivering quest without reverse scrolls (I remember iSro had few quest like this), many other things could be added as well.

vSro client also have craft system, but 95% servers don't even use it, I know many people never liked things like Tablets, because collecting elements was annoying and att. assimilation was much more annoying, but they can use it for other things, like crafting special stones (Roc stones) or upgrade scrolls for weapon/gear or anything, craft system is totally ignored.

Another point is, most of servers don't get an upgrade system, people get SoS, and when they have SoM, SoS becomes useless and they just sell it to NPC, the same happens with Sun, There are many ways to make servers interesting, one of them is upgrading items, who wouldn't like to enjoy that (for example) his moon +7 weapon became a sun weapon? or their Egypt B+7 weapon became a D12 nova weapon? All these things are interesting, but most of server devps nowdays are mentally handicapped to throw all moon/sun ***** into an NPC for whatever-coins/points.

[Mr_Chocolate]

Originally Posted by lucienne

This is unbelievable that most who posted here failed to understand that "reward for kill" (at CTF, and it's often seen in other events) is just wrong.
Stuff like "different builds have different chance in getting kills" should never be mentioned. This is really stupid. Rewards only for kill, in a TEAM based game, brings the whole play(teamwork) down to a primitive, lowest level, lowest quality of play. Such events, where only kill is rewarded, are just trash. It's only fun for those who know nothing about the game, and the only thing they can do is blunt damage rush.

But are you making it any better? <

You've got a point in there. You want it to be TEAM BASED reward instead of 1on1 KILL reward.
Cool. BUT it doesn't mean you fixed it, when you change it that way When there is something no good and you want to change it, you first THINK how it would actually be when you change it so it does worth changing it. What l'm trying to say is.. let's consider you made it team-based reward, K now I tell you the scenerio;

CTF:

Mentality => EACH PLAYERS FROM THE WINNER TEAM GETS XXX REWARD
Aim => Kill doesnt matter, but to have the flag captured right before CTF ends
What you don't want to do: Keep fighting bcuz it gets you literally no profit to kill an opponent.

so let's start;

- Kill mobs = 2 minutes
- Group fight, Team A vs Team B (2 minutes)
result: Team A wins the team fight

- Team B Regroups @ spawn
- Team A Regroups at their base near flag pole,

All the players waits till the last minute, (15 minutes)

- Team B rushes to team A base with zerks at last minute and tries to get the flag back.

If you'd want to win, you'd probably do this. Because it makes no sense to spawn and fight again on and on cuz killing doesn't get you any profit. So yeah, wait 15 minutes.. now where's the fun?

What l'm saying is there are really many things in Silkroad that are not actually fun anymore, or.. when you fix a problem, it might not actually get better and it'll somehow be abused bcuz it's extremely hard to cover everything nowadays.. (gotta love the community)

To sum up, you/we can complain about stuff buut how about coming up with a solution instead? or at least just thinking what the result would actually be after changing a feature in a certain way.

Finally, my solution for this case would probably be this:

CTF: team-based reward for the winner
Winner team gets the main reward (20 Arena Coins etc)
And each kill would grant you another reward so it worth trying to kill oppponents instead of AFKing.

peace bro