Tips for safer trading

[Syberboy]

Seeing as though we tend to get lots of scammers in the black market, and the fact that the hasn't actually been updated in quite a while and is only a general one.(Even though i have pm'd them about it T.T) Well i thought i should post some tips/guidelines that have been very useful to me. Also dont forget to check out the safety thread i have posted above, since it covers the parts I did not.

Also note* Please dont flame in this thread, i will report any flaming which will mean infractions. If you have any tips of your own that i have not listed, please post them so that i can add them to the list.

Tips for better trading safety.

• It is best to have a middleman in a trade if you're new or still not confident in trading by yourself. Mods work great since they are a trusted group of people who have been known to enforce the rules. Even so, you should ALWAYS take precautions.
  

• Remember to take a couple screen shots of the trade as well as chat log, also save the chat log of every trade. Also if possible take a screen shot of the trade ingame, if they come with their main. This makes it easier to spot the scammers.

• How to take a screen shot of your desktop:
   Spoiler

  1. Press the "Prnt Scrn" button.
  
  
  2. Open Microsoft Paint. To do this, click Start > All Programs > Accessories > Paint. Click inside the white part of the screen.
  
  3. While in paint, go to the Edit menu and click Paste or you can press and hold "Ctrl" and tap V.
  
  
  4. Save in the desire folder under the desire name
  
  5. Congrats! You have now taken a screen shot of your desktop.
  

REMEMBER: No matter how much good reputation a member has, it does not mean they are completely safe. I have already proven this with the case regarding LunarEclipse who had over 40+ iTrader +rep.

• It's logical that the person who has less reputation go first, since the person who has more has a higher chance of them not being a scammer.
  • When trading multiple things, it is easier and safer if you trade in parts. Take accounts as an example; you first trade the account's info (account's name/password), then after checking things out trade the register email.
  There is a difference between an email that the account is on and a register email. The register email no matter what will always have the power to get it's accounts back, even if you get acclaim to "change" the register email. So ask if they can prove that the email you are receiving is indeed the register email.

• If you are scammed by a member of elitepvpers, fill out a report of the scammer. Remember only cases with enough evidences such as multiple screen shots, and chat logs are investigated.

Originally Posted by Lowfyr

Scammer Accusation forum removal
EN:
We've decided to remove the scammer accusations forum because no one cared about the rules which made it impossible to moderate, please use the iTrader system (or tbm ratings for elite*gold) instead.

For elite*gold problems you can use the new forum.


DE:
Durch die massiven Regelverstöße im Scammer Accusations Forum sehen wir uns gezwungen dieses zu schließen, bitte benutzt das iTrader system (oder die tbm bewertungen für elite*gold) als Ersatz.

Für elite*gold Probleme könnt ihr das neue Forum benutzen.

• Remember a scammer will always tell you anything for the chance to scam you. So if an offer sounds too good to be true, chances are it is just that.

• Dont ever post your messenger id/email on this site. If you do give it out, do it through a private message and once they have added you, have them sent another message saying it was them that added you. This makes it so that scammers cant add you saying they're someone else when truly they're not and just saw you post your messenger in a post.
  Example:
  
   Spoiler

  Person A: I'm selling a 1## lvl account
  Person B: Hey ill buy your account, my msn is . Add me so we can discuss it
  
  Later on msn....
  Person B: who is this?
  Person C: Im person A.
  Person B awesome lets trade
  Person C: Ok, im going to scam you now ^^
  Person B: Aww person A Scammed me!
  
  Back on epvpers....
  Person B: you scammer!
  Person A: No i didn't?
  Person B: Yeah you did, your msn is
  Person A: No my email is
  Person B: Oh aww, thats what i get for posting my messenger ID to the public. T.T
  Person A: Yup sucks for you.

• Last but not least, if you feel ANY suspicion during the trade, back out right away. It is better to be safe than sorry.

[Vaidas B]

I think u forgot to add, that u should only use a BM mod as a middleman, they have green names, that are different then other users, so u cant make a name thats like they'ers.
Like waidas123. or anything like that.

The tips are useful so u get a thanks from me

[Syberboy]

Thank you Waidas ^^
Your tip has been added.

[trane.]

#Stickied

Even if there is an announcement about this, but with different tips for safe trading.

[LunarEclipse]

Originally Posted by Syberboy

Thank you Waidas ^^
Your tip has been added.

We have had issues but must say i like your thread, very good help for new members, as well as old members. A+ on this one, Thanks given.

[Syberboy]

Well my enemy's enemy is my friend. And thank you Lunar ^^

[nobody special]

What in the world is with this sudden push for mods to be middlemen?

Makes no sense at all. First saying that mods are trusted and should be middlemen, then telling the reality later in the post "Trust does not equal safety".

How about this safer trading tip:
Do not trust anyone more than you have to. I will expand on how much you "have to" later in this post.

Rather than pushing for even more people to be allowed access to a trade, how about posting some REAL safer trading tips. I have traded virtual items and accounts for years without the "assistance" of some unknown dude sitting behind the keyboard. Common sense really goes a long way.


So, here you go:

Ebay will remove auctions for virtual items in all games but Second Life (sometimes other games with Real Cash Economies as well, due to a debate about whether or not they are really games). This process usually takes about 48 hours, sometimes a little less. Plenty of time to sell a virtual item/account if you already have an interested buyer. Make them do an instant purchase on a fixed rate listing using the agreed upon price (Ebay charges about 12% for Buy It Now items, to the seller). Have them use Paypal for added speed and security. Do not accept other forms of payment, and buyers should really not wish to pay any other way. This about their security as well.

Paypal is amazingly good at mediating disputes. The do not like the arena of virtual items and accounts (at all), but are still quite helpful, so long as you have the proper proof of ownership, or proof that you did not get what you paid for. Fraps, screenshots, registered emails (send one to yourself from the registered email address, in advance, as additional proof that it was indeed your registered email for the game), and Read receipts (sent to the buyer upon payment, make sure the email contains all relevant info, acct name/pass, etc, and make sure the Read Receipt attached to the email is mandatory) will go a long way toward proving your ownership of said virtual items, and proving that you delivered them, in the case of accounts. (Paypal charges a 3% incoming funds fee, to the seller).
Buyers also have a crazy amount of security using paypal. All that has to happen is a buyer reporting not receiving an item, and the money gets put in limbo, frozen there until the dispute is resolved.

Sellers, keep the fees mentioned above in mind when negotiating your prices, you will end up paying 15% of whatever the total sales price is.



Using this combination, you can not only see if the seller is reputable (by their Ebay feedback), but if they scam you, Paypal can and will quite literally yank your money out of their bank account, regardless of whether or not it will cause overdraft fees. The seller side can more or less do the same thing. If you pay, and then cancel the payment, if the seller provides proof of sale, they can and will dip into the buyers bank account and make sure the money goes where it is supposed to.

Another bright side to using the Ebay/Paypal combination is that you have immediate proof that you are dealing with an adult, with a credit card to register. This will not outright eliminate scammers (some will go to great lengths), but it will certainly deter most of them.

These are ways to give yourself real security. Not foolproof, but a hell of a lot safer than trusting a moderator (or anyone else) on a hacker forum.

[~Kakkarot~]

Wrong, as much as it might bring you security it can also very well be and already is used for SCAMMING, people will buy the char, send the money, dispute and then they have the money and the char that they "boguht", paypal is one of the most unsafe way of sending/reciving payments, anyone can verify it with 100% fake info (become premium and you will know how to aswell). You can have 1000+ dollars in your paypal and if you do anything suspicious like loging in from another IP they will limit your account and your funds are never going to be spent. Every day there is like atleast 1 scamm in trading section, good scammers have great social engineering skills, they can pretty much convince anyone to go first and the just steal whatever they have.

Now please just tell me this, would you really trade head on with some member that joined in 2010 rather then have a 2 years old MODERATOR as a middle man and that way nobody can scam anyone.

It's never foolproof but this middleman way sure as hell beats any other way mentioned above.

Embrace the logic.

You don't like a middleman, fine, I guarantee you will be scammed more then anyone else here that would use the middleman.

This is not a push for a middle man, its a push for secure trades beacuse there is enugh scamming right now.

Pretty much everyone would like to have middlemans, pretty much all of us want moderator as a middleman.

And I just cannot understand how do you not see this from the logical side.

Trust noone? That makes me laugh, beacuse seller and buyer are reading this, and one of them has to go first, who will it be?

[LunarEclipse]

Originally Posted by ~Kakkarot~

Wrong, as much as it might bring you security it can also very well be and already is used for SCAMMING, people will buy the char, send he money, dispute and then they have the money and the char that they "boguht", paypal is once of the most unsafe way of sending/reciving payments, anyone can verify it with 100% fake info (become premium and you will know how to aswell). You can have 1000+ dollars in your paypal and if you do anything suspicious like loging in from another IP they will limit your account and your funds are never going to be spent. Every day there is like atleast 1 scamm in trading section, good scammers have gread social engineering skills, they can pretty much convince anyone to go first and the just steal whatever they have.

Now please just tell me this, would you really trade head on with some member that joined in 2010 rather then have a 2 years old MODERATOR as a middle man and that way nobody can scam anyone.

It's never foolproof but this middleman way sure as hell beats any other way mentioned above.

Embrace the logic.

You don't like a middleman, fine, I guarantee you will be scammed more then anyone else here that would use the middleman.

This is not a push for a middle man, its a push for secure trades beacuse there is enugh scamming right now.

Pretty much everyone would like to have middlemans, pretty much all of us want moderator as a middleman.

And I just cannot understand how do you not see this from the logical side.

Trust noone? That makes me laugh, beacuse seller and buyer are reading this, and one of them has to go first, who will it be?

I agree fully to your logic, and paypal indeed is really bad with a virtual item selling and buying. No one is covered by paypal on this type of transaction. So pretty much i guess that trane being middleman has been so far the best conversation ive seen on this forum in months.

[Syberboy]

Trust does equal safety when both sides are trusting each other. Also another thing about trust, you cannot gain it overnight, it has to be tested over and over again. Which is why i suggest mods of elitepvpers are are a good choice as the middleman. Almost all of them have been here longer than a year, showing their loyalty to the community. They have showed they're capable of enforcing the laws, as well as be able to moderate the forums, making sure it's appropriate and safe for everyone. Another reason why i suggested mods is because they are the least likely to scam you. That is compared to an account that was probably made yesterday, and only has 5 posts, 3 of which might even have been in your thread.

Also when i said

No matter how much good reputation a member has, it does not mean they are completely safe.

i was refering to their iTrader credits. I said this because it is quite easy to creat new accounts, +rep yourself, and get away with it. I see it all the time, and you will be surprise who does it.
Which also leads me to your reason of why ebay/paypal is "safer". It is just as easy to get good reputaion there as it is here. Not that hard to make a new account, change ips, use other computers then giving yourself good reputation.

Also by the way there is no age limit for credit cards, since banking accounts dont have age requirements. So this well is flawed.

Another bright side to using the Ebay/Paypal combination is that you have immediate proof that you are dealing with an adult, with a credit card to register. This will not outright eliminate scammers (some will go to great lengths), but it will certainly deter most of them.

[iuk1ngo]

nice tutorial thanks

[Syberboy]

thank you. ^^
hope they become useful to you one day

[Hellfire69]

Thanks for the awsome infos

[Syberboy]

Thread has been updated

[PsYcHo61]

Originally Posted by Syberboy

Later on msn....
Person B: who is this?
Person C: Im person A.
Person B awesome lets trade
Person C: Ok, im going to scam you now ^^
Person B: Aww person A Scammed me!

Back on epvpers....
Person B: you scammer!
Person A: No i didn't?
Person B: Yeah you did, your msn is
Person A: No my email is
Person B: Oh aww, thats what i get for posting my messenger ID to the public. T.T
Person A: Yup sucks for you. [/spoiler]

thats sounds so funny
really great tutorial thank you