Modding graphics of CO... I've been behind on the possibilities D:

[xBlackPlagu3x]

So it turns out... you've been able to... mod .c3 files this entire time? It's been my belief since early 2011 that this was impossible!... Am I really that blind? Am I so dense that I never ONCE saw any of the .c3 tutorials? I am truly ****** off. I am glad that you can do these kind of things, however! So as this is a discussion thread... let's discuss. For those of you who have ever created your own custom .c3 file or edited or w/e it is that you can do, is it hard? Tell me about it.

Example: Yeah, it was hard at first, but once you've created a few of your own weapons it kind of starts to sink in.

Note, that wasn't my experience. I have yet to experience creating my own .c3 file... but I'm curious as to what all of you think! I have, in my possession, 3DS Max 2010... although most people say to use 5 or 7... I honestly don't know the difference... is it.. 2005/2007? Or just simply 5/7? Idek. Is 2010 going to work just as well? So yeah, hit this thread up with your input!

[Kiyono]

You had to use 3DS Max 5/7 because the .c3 export plugin from TQ was made for those versions and refuses to work on the newer ones.

[Opale]

basically covers the basic and overall way of creating your own weapon 3D model, which will be converted to .c3.
It's not easy or hard.. it all depends on your abilities to use a 3D modelling software, I'd say it would be hard if you actually had to create your own textures from scratch, but you don't have to

About the "possible or impossible" question, I'd say you can basically do any static meshes you want to whatever its shape and texture is, it's just pure modelling.

The problem is when it comes to converting to .c3, we're getting limited :
- We can "only" create/modify : Weapons and shields, Hairstyles, NPCs ( no animations )
- We cannot create/modify : Basically all the rest, armors and garments, mounts, monsters, motion files and effect files ( too buggy n not worth it ).

You can also "edit" TQ's static .c3 files by converting them to .3ds using and then modify the 3D models as you want them to be, and finally reexporting to .c3

About 3DS versions, as Kiyono stated you can only use 3DS MAX 7 or 5 ( I'd go for 7 if I were you ) to convert your models to .c3, but you can perfectly create your models and texture them in 3DS MAX 2010 and then import them in 3DS MAX 7, It all depends of your convenience but imo 3DS MAX 7 is waaay enough for some low-polys modelling that Conquer's graphic engine requires.

Hope this helps !

[sharinggan]

all bow down, the great Thomas has spoken....

[xBlackPlagu3x]

Originally Posted by Opale

basically covers the basic and overall way of creating your own weapon 3D model, which will be converted to .c3.
It's not easy or hard.. it all depends on your abilities to use a 3D modelling software, I'd say it would be hard if you actually had to create your own textures from scratch, but you don't have to

About the "possible or impossible" question, I'd say you can basically do any static meshes you want to whatever its shape and texture is, it's just pure modelling.

The problem is when it comes to converting to .c3, we're getting limited :
- We can "only" create/modify : Weapons and shields, Hairstyles, NPCs ( no animations )
- We cannot create/modify : Basically all the rest, armors and garments, mounts, monsters, motion files and effect files ( too buggy n not worth it ).

You can also "edit" TQ's static .c3 files by converting them to .3ds using and then modify the 3D models as you want them to be, and finally reexporting to .c3

About 3DS versions, as Kiyono stated you can only use 3DS MAX 7 or 5 ( I'd go for 7 if I were you ) to convert your models to .c3, but you can perfectly create your models and texture them in 3DS MAX 2010 and then import them in 3DS MAX 7, It all depends of your convenience but imo 3DS MAX 7 is waaay enough for some low-polys modelling that Conquer's graphic engine requires.

Hope this helps !

Yeah, it helps a whole bunch. Oh and you too, Kiyono! But yeah, I hope to be making some epic edits. It's a shame that you can't make your own custom everything, that would be a genuine experience for me. I'm hoping between this modelling thing and creating a server that I will gain some major experience in how games work. Both client (design aspects) and server (obviously the networking aspect). Oh, and I bookmarked your guide last night xD

[Opale]

Originally Posted by sharinggan

all bow down, the great Thomas has spoken....

Psshhh I'm not exceptional nor did I do exceptional stuff

Originally Posted by xBlackPlagu3x

Yeah, it helps a whole bunch. Oh and you too, Kiyono! But yeah, I hope to be making some epic edits. It's a shame that you can't make your own custom everything, that would be a genuine experience for me. I'm hoping between this modelling thing and creating a server that I will gain some major experience in how games work. Both client (design aspects) and server (obviously the networking aspect). Oh, and I bookmarked your guide last night xD

That's cool to see someone interested in graphic stuff. Coders who start a project usually tend to ignore the graphic part of a server, they forget that it's as important as the coding aspect ( Sengoku team and Fang excepted )

You're right tho, it'd be an epic experience to be able to create our own armors, motion files, effects, skills... from scratch, a complete revamp of Conquer's graphics would be possible.

I know Zatoichi and Sengoku team got really really really far in the modification field and pushed it further than anyone ever had, but as far as I know they still cannot create the kind of stuff I stated above from scratch.. What a pity !

Anyway, you'll hopefully be able to create some cool stuff anyway I know my guide ain't really clear but it might help you out to get the bases, lemme know if there's a problem.

I just wish we could modify whatever we would want to - setting up our own DMAPs too ( Sengoku team can do that but not the rest of us, can we ? ) - but eh, I guess TQ cant have shitty protections everywhere ! =p

[xBlackPlagu3x]

Originally Posted by Opale

Psshhh I'm not exceptional nor did I do exceptional stuff



That's cool to see someone interested in graphic stuff. Coders who start a project usually tend to ignore the graphic part of a server, they forget that it's as important as the coding aspect ( Sengoku team and Fang excepted )

You're right tho, it'd be an epic experience to be able to create our own armors, motion files, effects, skills... from scratch, a complete revamp of Conquer's graphics would be possible.

I know Zatoichi and Sengoku team got really really really far in the modification field and pushed it further than anyone ever had, but as far as I know they still cannot create the kind of stuff I stated above from scratch.. What a pity !

Anyway, you'll hopefully be able to create some cool stuff anyway I know my guide ain't really clear but it might help you out to get the bases, lemme know if there's a problem.

I just wish we could modify whatever we would want to - setting up our own DMAPs too ( Sengoku team can do that but not the rest of us, can we ? ) - but eh, I guess TQ cant have ****** protections everywhere ! =p

What about editing Conquer 1.0 clients? I'm sure that the TQ protection is it's weakest on those clients. Is it just that the public .c3 plugin is a codec only for weapons .c3 files and it just can't create information for other objects' animations? Or is it that TQ forced everything else to be set-in-stone?

[pro4never]

The issue has nothing to do with protections.

It has to do with our lack of a proper plugin that will let us properly create/convert skeletons and animations for conquer.

Originally Posted by Opale

I just wish we could modify whatever we would want to - setting up our own DMAPs too ( Sengoku team can do that but not the rest of us, can we ? ) - but eh, I guess TQ cant have ****** protections everywhere ! =p

That boils down to interest really... I wrote a viewer and did a bit more with it but had no real reason to bother finishing the map designer... I might go back and allow conquer map support to be added to my new map designer but it's not what it's intended for :S.

All the files and information on how conquer maps work are fully documented and public... it just needs someone with a bit of coding knowledge and a reason to complete it to create a proper map editor. Personally I just don't have a reason to.

[Opale]

Originally Posted by xBlackPlagu3x

What about editing Conquer 1.0 clients? I'm sure that the TQ protection is it's weakest on those clients. Is it just that the public .c3 plugin is a codec only for weapons .c3 files and it just can't create information for other objects' animations? Or is it that TQ forced everything else to be set-in-stone?

I said protection for a lack of a better word but pro4never said it all

The problem is the public plugin released that is not really fully fonctionnal. To realize animations and motions you may use vertices, bones, skeletons set up on various keyframes and other stuff to automatize your animations. The .c3 plugin out there does not import/export every informations.
Each time, the motion and animation part of the .c3 file gets lost during the "delivery/receiption" of the converted file.
That's the same stuff for every CO versions.

That's what I understood, atleast, please correct me if i'm wrong !

Well anyway, you can do plenty of stuff with static meshes that can make your server really "custom" and you should not worry about the glows n skills part, TQ's .c3 files are kind of well-made and you can do some pretty much unique stuff editing .dds files only.

The only bad part of that limited plugin is the armor/mobs creation from scratch/editing being impossible for now =/

Originally Posted by pro4never

All the files and information on how conquer maps work are fully documented and public... it just needs someone with a bit of coding knowledge and a reason to complete it to create a proper map editor. Personally I just don't have a reason to.

I got your point, and i'm not even sure if it would be worth it to finish it anyway in a sense I don't know anybody as crazy and talented as Zatoichi to be willing to create a whole new custom map from scratch. I'd be interested in creating a new little city or something, but that's nothing =/
And if it's not to implement the maps from other TQ games or to add new custom maps I don't see any interest in having a fully working map editor, too much effort put in a program that won't be used to its max capacities..

[xBlackPlagu3x]

Aw, so you can't even add custom glows to weapons? So lame =/ Hopefully someday either someone or I will have the knowledge to make a fully functional .c3 plugin and release it. If I ever get to the point of figuring it out and nobody has released it, then I shall. But that's a loooooong way away from now.

[pro4never]

Originally Posted by xBlackPlagu3x

Aw, so you can't even add custom glows to weapons? So lame =/ Hopefully someday either someone or I will have the knowledge to make a fully functional .c3 plugin and release it. If I ever get to the point of figuring it out and nobody has released it, then I shall. But that's a loooooong way away from now.

Custom glows are easy. I seem to remember them just being a simple effect. Same difficulty as editing a spell look.

[Opale]

Originally Posted by xBlackPlagu3x

Aw, so you can't even add custom glows to weapons? So lame =/ Hopefully someday either someone or I will have the knowledge to make a fully functional .c3 plugin and release it. If I ever get to the point of figuring it out and nobody has released it, then I shall. But that's a loooooong way away from now.

You can perfectly make a super custom glow editing .dds files only !
And there's a lot of doable stuff that can easily match your weapon: Outer glow, trail, displacement maps "onto" the weapon, and then every little details you may want to add like some firey or smokey stuff, or some kind of psychic effect..
There are also a few effects that can be completely done in 3DSMAX but they end up being bugged or not working correctly once added in-game.. completely not worth it.

Almost everything is makable.. it just that it .. can't be "perfectly done" because we cannot modify the base animation, its size, its rotation, its speed, or whatever.

It's indeed a big lack - It'd be crazy to be able to add those new lv140 EO weapon effects, especially the blade one, simply breath-taking - or to create whole new effects and animations or armors from scratch; but you can always do what you can with what you have since I doubt there will be someday someone working on a fully functional .c3 plugin as programmers however you call them ( excepted sparkie n ulti that upgraded the public one for Sengoku apparently but it will remain private ) just have no interest in making one...