Help About Coding

[CantShutMyMouth]

Hello Guys. I'm 17 years old and i see thw world is going to the computers and automated tehnology era.So,i wanna learn some coding.I need some coders to tell wich one to learn.

I dont want to learn just to make a hack for my game or something,im not a kid


-AutoIT: Don't know how much it helps,but i already learned alot of it in 1 month.It's easy,but is not really usefull
-C++: I don't know nothing about it just want to make .dll Files.is C++ same with VisualBasic.Is C++ same with Delphi.Wich one is better?
-Java: Can't say anything

As i said,im not a kid,i know it may take years of working...but i will try to do my best.

EDIT: My HighScool has an "MySQL Optional Course".Should i go to it?

I want to create Programs,hacks( in .dll extension),and other stuffs like those.

[Jeoni]

I want to create Programs,hacks( in .dll extension),and other stuffs like those.

Do you even know what a DLL is for and why do you want to make a hack with that. I know that there are good reasons, but I want to know if you know them or are you just like "DLL H4xxorzZ are cool so I want to make them".

Now to your question(s). If you want to make DLL's you should learn C/C++. With.net languages (vb.net, C# and C++/CLI) you can make DLL's, too, but this DLLs are managed code, so it's more difficult to inject them (not impossible) and they have a lack of performance if you compare them to native DLLs written in any other language. AutoIt is **** if you want to make some bigger projects (= with more than one thread). I don't know anything about Delphi. Java's advantage is that you can run your programms at any plattform, which supports the JRE. But because of this JRE it's not very good for hacking (as I heard). So I think you should learn C or C++ (but not C++/CLI!). There are many Threads in this forum about "what language should I learn". You should use the search function.

To your course: If you want to learn something about SQL and databases you schould visit it. If not, it's waste of time. I would go there because databases are really common in the world and it's not bad to know something about them.

[CantShutMyMouth]

No,i'm not like "Dll haxxzor are cool". I know what the .dll files are doing.As i said,im not a kid.
I think i will just go to a private course of C++ 2 hours/week untill i will understand,then buy some books and try to learn by myself.

[MrSm!th]

That's a waste of money.
First you can try a free internet tutorial to see whether you really want to learn that language. Then just buy a book and program, program, program.
The best way is learning by doing.

[CantShutMyMouth]

Still not understand if MySQL can help me,beacause that course it's free....
Anyway,i thought a bit and i wanna learn C++.But still need some answers:

Visual Basic uses the same codes as C++
Delphi is the same with C++?

[マルコ]

So basically you just want to learn how to code so that you can code. Doesn't make sense. In my opinion, there has to ba a motivation, or you will fail to learn it. You will lose motivation. If you don't no anything about coding, the first steps are the most difficult. I think, everyone who learned and learns coding did or does so because they needed it. I needed it to make programs that suit my taste.
Before learning to code (and also choosing a language), you should think about "WHY" you want to learn it. Is there anything that you want for which you really have to learn how to code? If there is something, you can make a better decision with the language. Because different languages serve different purposes.

I make a lot of GUI based programs, therefore I am a Delphiholic. In my opinion, there is no better IDE or language concept to make GUI based applications this easily. Basically, there is no easier language than Delphi, because if you use clean pseudocode, it is mostly nearly Delphi code. If that's what you want to do, then just contact me and I will give you a brief overview about Delphi - so you can still decide.

C++ is the most used language. It's can be quit low level. It's quiet easy to use. Most software snippets are also available in C++. Maybe you intend to make a game? Then C++ is the language of choice.
C++ can produce crossplatform applications for every platform. But it's harder to learn.

Java is a nice mix of good features. You can easily make crossplatform applications with Java. But keep in mind, Java is not that performant and also Java always needs a VM to run. So you also can't make realtime critical applications.

As for VB: I don't like it. I do not recommend you to learn it. I know, there are other people who will tell you otherwise, but that is my opinion. Also I have never seen any great programs written in VB. Says everything.
Also, VB automatically does a lot of things itself. But I like having control about my application.

Of course there is also C#, which I also do not know that well. I don't have an oppinion about it, so ask someone else ;P

btw.: Do not use .NET. It is no good. You are completely dependant on Windows.

All in all I want to recommend Delphi. It is very easy code - you basically just can read it and you will understand what it does without knowing anything about Delphi.
You will not need to install runtimes for Delphi applications.
Delphi can make crossplatform applications. Officially, Win32/64 and OSX are supported, but there is a opensource compiler for nearly every platform.
And also it uses the Visual-Component-Library and the FireMonkey framework for visual applications, so it's independant from Microsoft and stuff.

Edit: Between the languages, some functions are the same (mostly API functions), but there are also a lot of differences!

MySQL will not help you a lot. It's mainly usefull for Homepages.

[MrSm!th]

But it [C++] is harder to learn.

It's not.

Still not understand if MySQL can help me,beacause that course it's free....

No, there is no relation between MySQL and C++.

Visual Basic uses the same codes as C++

No.

Delphi is the same with C++?

No.

Also, VB automatically does a lot of things itself. But I like having control about my application.

Then, why you recommend Java or the GUI System of Delphi?
You are talking about VB.NET btw. and this is bascially the same as C# and comparable to Java, because all of them are languages which run on a VM.

btw.: Do not use .NET. It is no good. You are completely dependant on Windows.

Wrong. There is Mono for Linux and the .NET Framework is basically the same as the JVM.
Oh and if you are completely against the .NET FW, then you also have an opinion about C#, because it is a .NET language as VB.NET is.
VB without .NET is very rare nowadays.

All in all I want to recommend Delphi. It is very easy code - you basically just can read it and you will understand what it does without knowing anything about Delphi.

Said by someone who wants full control of his application.

You will not need to install runtimes for Delphi applications.

You don't need any runtimes for C++ or C either. You actually don't need runtimes for any native language, that's why they are native.
You need runtimes for .NET languages and for Java, but .NET and the JRE are bascially installed on nearly every (windows) pc.
You need runtimes for special libraries, but if any library needs a runtime lib, then it needs it, no matter which language you use, so yes, you would have to install a "runtime" for Delphi then, too.

but there is a opensource compiler for nearly every platform.

I highly doubt that.

And also it uses the Visual-Component-Library and the FireMonkey framework for visual applications, so it's independant from Microsoft and stuff.

Every native language is independent from Microsoft. C/C++ can be used on any other system as well.

Edit: Between the languages, some functions are the same (mostly API functions), but there are also a lot of differences!

Well, no. The languages differ in syntax, concepts and the standard scope. APIs (for example the API of the OS) can be ported to any other language, they have nothing to do with the language itself.

I start thinking you actually don't know any other language than Delphi and just enumerate pseudo-arguments for it to convince other people.

@Topic:
Well, he said he wants to create hacks, which excludes Java from the list, because it is really hard and uncomfortable to use Java for it. He also said he wants to make Dll hacks, which is hard (not impossible) in .NET languages, although they might fullfill his needs (even though they are evil Microsoft languages..), so we can leave them out as well.
Only native languages like C/C++ or Delphi stay in the list.
Well, i would tend to C++ rather than Delphi, because there are far more libs and code snippets out there for C++. It has the better features to use it as a hacking language (you can write lowlevel code a bit better, since Delphi for instance does not support other calling conventions than __stdcall) as well, and the GUI can be coded with QT, wxWidgets, MFC, ...
He could even use a mix of C#/VB.NET and C++ to write the GUI in a .NET language, which is indeed more comfortable and write the internal hacking code in native C++.

[HellSpider]

I'd suggest C++. Like someone said already, motivation is what drives you further, the beginning is the hardest part. Much of the knowledge is too just coding, coding and more coding. Books and tutorials will just assist, they wont play the most significant part.

Just in case you want to know, I code in MASM (Microsoft Assembler) but that's not generally a good choice unless you want 100% control of the code and are willing to write a lot of code for a simple program.

[マルコ]

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

It's not.

I state MY opinion. As always. If you do not understand that different people work differently and think differently, then you got the wrong job on this board. Imho, Delphi is the easiest langúage to learn. You don't need any pointers or stuff. You just write what you need and it works. At least in the beginning.

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Then, why you recommend Java or the GUI System of Delphi?

I also stated, that Java has a lot of disadvantages, but at least it can be used as crossplatform language.
Delphi?? Dude, have you ever used Delphi in your life? Every freaking component can be edited as I wish. I can even recode the system .pas files. Basic functions base on ASM. How much more control can you have???

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

You are talking about VB.NET btw. and this is bascially the same as C# and comparable to Java, because all of them are languages which run on a VM.

Not only VB.NET. But as I said, I do not use those languages, so there are other people with more knowledge who should state their opinion.

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Wrong. There is Mono for Linux and the .NET Framework is basically the same as the JVM.
Oh and if you are completely against the .NET FW, then you also have an opinion about C#, because it is a .NET language as VB.NET is.
VB without .NET is very rare nowadays.

One point for you ;P

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Said by someone who wants full control of his application.

As I said, you have the control. So don't say shit.

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

You don't need any runtimes for C++ or C either. You actually don't need runtimes for any native language, that's why they are native.
You need runtimes for .NET languages and for Java, but .NET and the JRE are bascially installed on nearly every (windows) pc.
You need runtimes for special libraries, but if any library needs a runtime lib, then it needs it, no matter which language you use, so yes, you would have to install a "runtime" for Delphi then, too.

No. Delphi compiles everything it needs directly into the application. This of course also can be a bad thing. You don't know anything about Delphi, so why attack it?

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

I highly doubt that.

Freepascal and official compiler. Of course, you can forget about consoles. But I am able to make Applications for Win, OSX, IPhone and Linux. I haven already succeeded to make applications for all of those platforms. There is even an IDE: Lazarus -.-

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Every native language is independent from Microsoft. C/C++ can be used on any other system as well.

If you don't get my point, don't write shit.

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Well, no. The languages differ in syntax, concepts and the standard scope. APIs (for example the API of the OS) can be ported to any other language, they have nothing to do with the language itself.

Well YES, that's exactly what I said, except I used fewer words -.-

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

I start thinking you actually don't know any other language than Delphi and just enumerate pseudo-arguments for it to convince other people.

Now, I don't care what you think about me. This is some board on the internet, like any other board. There are retarded people, there are idiots, and I really don't care what you think.
But it's highly unprofessional of a MODERATOR to write stuff about things you don't even know and then try to use that as arguments against someone.
Just learn, that you are only another person in this world. You are not allmighty and all knowledgeable.


That's all from my side. I will ignore future responses from your side on this offtopic stuff.

As for my rights and stuff:
*** These are my thoughts. If I offended someone, deal with it. I am allowed to believe what I want to and tell it to the world. ***

[nkkk]

Sql wont help you learning c++, but its usefull to know sql when you want to know more about coding, even if you want to write hacks its usefull to know sql, for example:
1) you can store the data of your hacks in a sql database (could be a good idea if your tool uses a huge amount of data)
2) because most games store their data in sql db its usefull to know sql because understanding the game is important to write verygood hacks.
3) mabe if you find a real security gap in a game you could abouse it with sql injection

[MoepMeep]

@マルコ I love making fun of smith, but I have to admit, even he knows more than you.

Well, he said he wants to create hacks, which excludes Java from the list, because it is really hard and uncomfortable to use Java for it. He also said he wants to make Dll hacks, which is hard (not impossible) in .NET languages, although they might fullfill his needs (even though they are evil Microsoft languages..), so we can leave them out as well.

JNA/JNI, not that hard Same for C#.

[Dr. Coxxy]

lets start:

Delphi is the easiest langúage to learn. You don't need any pointers or stuff. You just write what you need and it works. At least in the beginning.

sounds like apple - i dont want to make hacks on macs - it sucks.

lets quote the op:

I want to create Programs,hacks( in .dll extension),and other stuffs like those.

You don't need pointers or stuff

hacks

I see a high contrast between those - who else does?

No. Delphi compiles everything it needs directly into the application. This of course also can be a bad thing. You don't know anything about Delphi, so why attack it?

you just dont get what mr. smith tries to say.
for example if you load a dll which is made in C++ and which needs a framework - this framework has to be installed.

Well YES, that's exactly what I said, except I used fewer words -.-

Well NO, lets quote you:

Between the languages, some functions are the same (mostly API functions), but there are also a lot of differences!

APIs have NOTHING, really NOTHING to do with the language.
the syntax of function-calls may differ, but this has nothing to do with some api.

Now, I don't care what you think about me. This is some board on the internet, like any other board. There are retarded people, there are idiots, and I really don't care what you think.
But it's highly unprofessional of a MODERATOR to write stuff about things you don't even know and then try to use that as arguments against someone.
Just learn, that you are only another person in this world. You are not allmighty and all knowledgeable.

you just dont understand his point of view, since youre fixed on delphi - not the other way around.

That's all from my side. I will ignore future responses from your side on this offtopic stuff.

i would appreciate this.

b2t:
the #1 for hacking and general coding at a mid/high language level is still C and C++, stick with those and you cant do anything wrong.

[CantShutMyMouth]

Thanks to everyone,i have made a decision.I'm in holiday,for 3 months.From autumn i will start the 12' clas,in wich i will learn the basics of C++....but...since i'm in holiday,i will see about Delphi first.If i like it,i will keep on learning Delphi,if not....C++.

Thanks to everyone.
One more question:

Are there some codes in C++/Delphi like some in AutoIt? Not all,just some codes and commands,cause i'm reallt familiar with AutoIt

[MrSm!th]

No, the AutoIt syntax is very...peculiar...and AutoIt already does very much for you so that you basically don't have to care about some things you have to deal with in other languages.
Well, for hacking, the Windows API stays the same, only the way how to call it will change for you.

That's all from my side. I will ignore future responses from your side on this offtopic stuff.

Well, no matter if you really will, I want to reply anyway.
(this is a very childish attitude btw.)

I state MY opinion. As always. If you do not understand that different people work differently and think differently, then you got the wrong job on this board. Imho, Delphi is the easiest langúage to learn. You don't need any pointers or stuff. You just write what you need and it works. At least in the beginning.

For hacking you need pointers. And Delphi also supports pointers - for a reason. Well, I did not intend to impose my opinion on you, I just wanted to say that every language is actually just a set of syntax rules (vocabulary) and programming concepts. If you once understood those concepts, every process of learning a language is basically just a process of learning vocabulary for you. Delphi might indeed have an advantage, because the syntax is rather "language-like" (I don't know how to express it..the syntax is more similar to normal languages) than a set of cryptic symbols like C, but that is something that everyone has to decide on his own. I see no real difference between them. Btw. GUI programming and stuff cannot be counted as learning a language, because you first learn the syntax and that is the same for every language. Only how fast and comfortably you can develope stuff differs from language to language.

Delphi?? Dude, have you ever used Delphi in your life? Every freaking component can be edited as I wish. I can even recode the system .pas files. Basic functions base on ASM. How much more control can you have???

VB.NET does not do more things without you than Java or Delphi, that's what I wanted to say.

You just write what you need and it works. At least in the beginning.

As I said, you have the control. So don't say shit.

Well, you have to decide. First you say that you don't have to really know the language, then you say how much you like the way how Delphi does everything on its own and how you don't have to deal with much and then you are saying one has the full control.

No. Delphi compiles everything it needs directly into the application. This of course also can be a bad thing. You don't know anything about Delphi, so why attack it?

This is just wrong, the best example is Windows itself.
If you use some NT API functions, your program basically links the ntdll.dll and it is loaded dynamically. The code is not built into your program; that's not even possible, since the code belongs to the OS. And this is the same for many other APIs as well, because static linking - indeed - IS a bad thing. It increases the size of the executable unnecessarily and you have to update the whole executable, if you want to update the library. Windows is not delivered in hundreds of system dlls, because they thought it was fun. And as I said, other languages support static linking as well.
Show me one native language which always needs runtime libraries to be installed on your system.

Freepascal and official compiler. Of course, you can forget about consoles. But I am able to make Applications for Win, OSX, IPhone and Linux. I haven already succeeded to make applications for all of those platforms. There is even an IDE: Lazarus -.-

Wow, 4 plattforms is really much. There are actually hundreds or thousands of plattforms. Can you program embedded systems with Delphi? I don't know many chips which have Delphi compilers.

If you don't get my point, don't write shit.

So, what is your point? You say that you are independent from M$ with Delphi, but you are not dependent with C, C++, C#, VB.NET, J#, Java, Fortran, Python and many other languages either.

Well YES, that's exactly what I said, except I used fewer words -.-

As Coxxy said, no, you were talking about APIs and they are defined by your environment like OS (or for virtual languages the VM), frameworks, etc. and not by the language itself.

Now, I don't care what you think about me. This is some board on the internet, like any other board. There are retarded people, there are idiots, and I really don't care what you think.

Good for you, I did not intend to offend you or make you feel silenced by me.

But it's highly unprofessional of a MODERATOR to write stuff about things you don't even know and then try to use that as arguments against someone.

I find it really unprofessional to get personally offending, just because I do not share your opinion about Delphi. Well, I know more about .NET and C/C++, as you already admitted. I may not know much about Delphi, but I know about general circumstances which apply to any language and I know in which cases Delphi is used and in which not.

Just learn, that you are only another person in this world. You are not allmighty and all knowledgeable.

So what? Does that mean that the facts I listed in previous posts are wrong?

*** These are my thoughts. If I offended someone, deal with it. I am allowed to believe what I want to and tell it to the world. ***

I do not feel offended, but no, I will not deal with it, if I do.
This is a forum where freedom of speech is important, but if you get offending and insulting people, things get serious and I won't tolerate that in my section. You are allowed to believe what you want and tell it, but only in a friendly way.

JNA/JNI, not that hard Same for C#.

Well, it makes Java at least a rarely chosen language, since it is harder to use the system API than in other languages.
I didn't say it was hard in C#, C# actually supports direct Windows API access, as far as I know.
But making Dll hacks in C# is harder than in other languages, since you have to learn a native language anyway, to create the .NET host in the target application.
And Java cannot even be used for dlls.

[MoepMeep]

Originally Posted by MrSm!th

Well, it makes Java at least a rarely chosen language, since it is harder to use the system API than in other languages.

Well, you have to write a class for that once :|

I didn't say it was hard in C#, C# actually supports direct Windows API access, as far as I know.
But making Dll hacks in C# is harder than in other languages, since you have to learn a native language anyway, to create the .NET host in the target application.

Could you atleast get your facts right once? No need for native code, I allready told you that a few weeks ago.