Data tool crash on specific offsets.

10/02/2014 09:47 Thunder-Forge#1
Greetings.
I was experimenting with bone structures, 3do files, offsets, and came across a strange (consistant) bug in LPH's data tool or maybe my hands are just curved... Either way, here is the issue. A non-shaiya 3do file, trying to bind it into hand properly, so it is not floating around requires offset editing, after several attempts, noticed that whenever i try to enter exact coordinates according to bone structure, data file tool comes up with the same error, and so far the only way of "fixing" it, is to change the offset by 0.001 in either direction, which is not really noticable, yet annoying at times. In some cases this appears on rotations and scalings as well, which can be very frustrating. Haven't tried compiling a client with said files, only importing so far. Did a search, but nothing really came up. Any ideas?
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Error log
10/02/2014 17:19 Truth1010#2
This error is not caused by the Data File Tool. It's caused with converting offsets from foreign files using tools such as the 3DoC tool we have access to. It's due to the build in limitations on scale/rotation of certain items (weapons in your case)

These are the problems you get when taking a game's file and trying to force it into another game.
10/02/2014 20:00 Thunder-Forge#3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth1010 View Post
These are the problems you get when taking a game's file and trying to force it into another game.
That's obvious and expected, i was just wondering why those exact points, because i can move/scale/rotate pretty much unlimited in every other direction.
10/02/2014 20:26 Truth1010#4
Seems to be no set 'rule' as to why. Sometimes it's the offset being out by 0.001, other times it's the rotation being out by a small amount.

I would assume that each "type" of weapon has set limits that it must be placed into for it to work. But where to see those limits, or how to test what they are, seems out of my knowledge.
I too noticed the same error through DataFileTool with scaling/rotating/moving the designs.
10/02/2014 22:21 nubness#5
The data file tool doesn't care if the file you're importing is a Shaiya model, a picture of Hitler or a porn video. There's probably a bug in the application, it happens.

Suggestions:
  1. Remake your client and try to import again. If that fails:
  2. Download [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click Here To Register...] (which is known to have some bugs as well) and try it out, it may be able to do it.
10/02/2014 23:23 Thunder-Forge#6
Trying to import directly gives this error.
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Compiling a new client with files goes fine, but crashes the sgraphic as soon as character screen starts loading in.
10/02/2014 23:42 Truth1010#7
I'm just going to assume you are using the 3DoC tool to 'convert' the files into a useable format.. what i found with that is, if you move the 'camera' view of the item in that tool, before or after you set offsets etc. then you'll get the error, regardless of the points you use. Again, it must be a limit to the individual file, but where/why is unknown.
10/03/2014 00:01 Thunder-Forge#8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth1010 View Post
what i found with that is, if you move the 'camera' view of the item in that tool, before or after you set offsets etc. then you'll get the error, regardless of the points you use.
Yes, at first i had same suspicion, but even not touching the camera at all gives the same results. Only reason i can figure out so far is that you are not allowed to move offsets past inner bone structure points, otherwise it interferes with animation files. Noticed this with claws explicitly, and it's impossible to move them closer to body, as by default they are bound closer to upper side of palm than fist.
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It seems as the claw bindpoint is not exactly in middle of fist, but rather off, just the graphics of handle are adjusted to fit it.
10/03/2014 01:11 castor4878#9
Thank nubness, I failed to understand what could be the issue with "LPH's data tool" when it comes with "bone structures, 3do files, offsets".

indeed, LPH data tool didn't transform garbage into meaningful data when you pack (*NOT* compile) some,
and indeed, a .3DO do *NOT* contain any bone, and a position is NOT an offset.

that said, the client never crashes because of a shift of 0.001 of one point, OOH, it always crashes if the .3DO stream is invalid.
can you open the .3DO your shStudio ? it will be succesfully opened by shaiya client *even* if your sword is 352 meters long and located at 147 meters of the toon that handles it.
can not open with shStudio ? you probably forgot to set the right type when you save it.
10/03/2014 01:36 Thunder-Forge#10
Quote:
Originally Posted by castor4878 View Post
can you open the .3DO your shStudio ? it will be succesfully opened by shaiya client *even* if your sword is 352 meters long and located at 147 meters of the toon that handles it.
That's the thing, making a sword half across the map and flying is absolutely no issue. Done it, had lols, moved on. My theory was that it might be because file is placed over some of these points in hands, but more educated conclusions are welcome.
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You say offset is not a position, sorry i just adopted the term used in converter, since it's what it does.
10/03/2014 01:59 castor4878#11
an "offset" is (usually) used the define the distance between a specific location (very usally in a 1D sequence) and a fixed origin (such as the begining of a file).
dealing with 3D geometry, we prefer position or location or coordinates.
but my point was to explain why I didn't understand the 1st post, and especially not to teach a vocabulary lesson.

your pict displays the bones of the .3DC files (all .3DC contains the all the bones of the full skeleton); a .3DO file doesn't contain bone, all its vertices (3D points) are relative to "one" point of the hand (for weapons), there is no evidence that this point is one of the bone of the hand or a (kind of) barycenter of the vertices defining the hand.